Secret and Suppressed: Banned Ideas and Hidden History (50 page)

HK: Guess what?

DS: You too?

HK: My parents are from Krakow.

DS: Well, we’re not from Krakow, but from near Krakow. My mother’s from Rudnick, my father from Gruns, near Tano. Do you know where Tano is?

HK: Yes. Let me tell you…

DS: … don’t have many left. Everybody got killed.

HK: Let me tell you. The same with me. Let me tell you, my parents were the only ones who came out. Let me tell you, my…

DS: You’re a Holocaust survivor?

HK: Yeah, no, not me, my parents.

DS: That’s some experience, I’ve got two cousins, I’ve got one in Israel and one in France that came out of Mauthausen, I’ll tell you, and everybody else dead on my father’s side in Russia. I just brought six of them from Koshkent to Israel last year.

HK: Right. Let me tell you that, you know what my father always says? My father was a rich man in Poland, and he says, “Economic power is very good. You have to have money, but if you just have economic power and you don’t have political power…”

DS: You’ve got nothing.

HK: You’ve got nothing.

DS: If we had AIPAC in the ‘30s and ‘40s, we would have saved millions of Jews. We would have the political power. But Jews were afraid to open their mouths. They didn’t know how.

HK: AIPAC started after WWII?

DS; Oh, sure.

HK: And if you would have had AIPAC in the ‘30s?

DS: I feel we would’ve saved a lot of Jews.

HK: And Franklin Roosevelt, he could’ve done a lot better?

DS: Sure, he could. The Jews never opened their mouths. They were afraid. We’re not afraid. They can curse me out, I don’t care if they hate me, just as long as I get what we need for our people.

HK: So if you had a little lamp, a wishing lamp, and you could wish for either Bush, Clinton or Perot…

DS: Clinton.

HK: Clinton all the away? And in terms of Israel having political power, between the three candidates, the one who will give us the most political power?

DS: Clinton is the best guy for us.

HK: He’s the best one.

DS: I hope you’re serious about what you told me?

HI: I am, I’ll tell you this [tells a long anecdote about David Souter promising to oppose abortion as a nominee and then reversing himself on the Supreme Court]. So I wish we had a Jewish candidate for president.

DS: I don’t think the country’s ready.

HK: If the country was ready, is there any Jewish candidate…?

DS: I wouldn’t venture to say anything.

HK: You know who? I don’t know him, I’ve never met him, Joe Lieberman.

DS: Oh, I’m very friendly with Joe. I’m having dinner with him Monday night.

HK: Let me tell you, I think Joe Lieberman would have, uh, would have, if he wasn’t Jewish, that’s the only problem he has. He’s highly respected.

DS: I’d like to see him on the Supreme Court.

HK: If Clinton is elected, has he told you who he’s going to put on the Supreme Court?

DS: We’re talking now. We don’t have, no commitments yet. We’re just negotiating. We’re more interested right now, in the Secretary of State and the Secretary of the National Security Agency. That’s more important to us.

HK: If Clinton is elected, who do you think will be Secretary of State?

DS: We don’t know yet, we’re negotiating.

Hk: Who are you hoping for?

Ds: I’ve got a list. But I really can’t go through it. I’m not allowed to talk about it.

HK: But you figure, God willing, if Clinton’s elected…

DS: We’ll have access.

HK: You’ll have access and you’ll have a good input into who’s Secretary of State.

DS: I do believe so.

HK: And the other position is…

DS: National Security Adviser.

HK: Those are the two critical positions.

DS: Right.

HK: Gotcha. Well, David, thanks for talking with me.

DS: And we’re going to get together next week. I hope you’ll have your checkbook ready.

A typescript of four conversations taped in 1981 between an investigative reporter and a person purporting to be an operative for the post-war Nazi International (also known as the International Fascista, the Odessa, and Kamaradenwerk) came to Feral House under mysterious circumstances. Apparently, the investigative reporter found the material to be “too hot” and dropped it in the lap of the flea market and mail-order entrepreneur John Aes-Nihil, who in turn passed on the material to Feral House. An investigation enabled us to locate the interviewer, who wishes to remain anonymous. He was able to answer many of our questions about the alleged operative and the circumstances of the interview, as well as providing independent confirmation of at least one of the operative’s visits to Nazi International chief Otto Skorzeny.

The editor, publisher and interviewer do not rule out the possibility that the information in this interview is wholly or partly imaginative or disinformational. There is another possibility. These conversations may provide the clearest view yet afforded of the inner workings of the post-war Nazi hierarchy, as well as providing clues about many of the conspiracies and major terrorist actions of the Twentieth Century.

Names of private individuals, included in the original manuscript, have been deleted.

My name is K., and for the past ten years I have served with the international Nazi Party organization as Inspector General or Liaison between central headquarters and operatives in the field. I would report on actions under way, supply data, information for possible actions in the future, and financial and personal data on individuals in different parts of the world. The Nazi Party organization is composed in two basic parts: the working organization, made up of former SS military officers, former members of the Nazi party, and the second section of German industrialists and businessmen who financially support and provide the logistics support for operations of this organization. They have been involved with and responsible for a number of operations in the past years, among them the DC-10, the problems it has had; recent fires and calamities in Nevada. They have set up and provide logistic and financial support for organizations such as the Irish Republican Army and the Palestine Liberation Organization; they have and currently are involved with top level individuals in the Reagan administration; they have been involved with the West German government intimately regarding such events as the Munich massacre during the Olympics of ‘72.

My personal involvement with them is about ten years, and during that time I have moved up to the present position.

—
Why don’t we start with your initial meeting [with a contact to the Organization] in the gun shop in Newport Beach, California? How did you happen to be there and what happened once you were there?

I was on a vacation, and I was interested in going to the gun shop. I used to collect various war memorabilia, and it looked like it had that type of thing in it. I was talking to a young man who was a salesman in the shop, and B. when he came in, we got into a conversation about military collectibles. By the end of the conversation he said, “Why don’t you come over to my house. I have some things I’d like to show you.” So we went over there and had a pretty nice discussion.

—
What sort of things did he have, that he collects?

Medals, particularly medals and orders. I had said that I made trips overseas, and he said, “Ah, I go there quite often. I work for an American company and when I’m over there I have a chance to pick up various pieces.”

We eventually got around to Otto — Otto Skorzeny. He says, “Oh, yes, I’ve sold him some things.” I said, “I’d really like to meet him.” He said, “That’s fine. I could arrange that for you. Just let me know when you’re going.” A few weeks later I got in touch with him and told him I was going overseas again, to Europe and could he help me out? He said, “Sure. Stop by when you’re here again and I’ll give you something.”

—
What year was this?

‘70, ‘71 maybe. He took out the card, Skorzeny’s card … it had Skorzeny’s handwritten signature across the front, like mine has, and it was blank in back, whereas mine has writing on it — you have the copy of it. He wanted to know when I’d be over there, so he could make me a specific appointment, and I said okay, gave him the time… and I went over.

I took the train from Paris to Munich, overnight train, the Orient Express, and I got settled in at the Konigshoff Hotel, about a block from the Munich train station. At that time I did not know what was going on, so I innocently called from the hotel, not from my room but from the reception desk, put through a call to Skorzeny and here’s his phone number, in Madrid, Spain. I got him on the line and said, “This is K – and B. said…” and he said, “Oh, yes, I’m looking forward to meeting you…” and that I come down at such-and-such a time.

Got down to Madrid and checked into the Castellano Hotel, the Hilton. We got there and called Otto and he said, “Just come right over.” From that first time and in all our subsequent meetings at his home, we never met at his office. I got to his home and one thing I noticed — then and at all times — at either end of this nice quiet residential street in the outskirts, there was always a car at each end with men in each car. I was a little nervous about it — it didn’t seem right.

—
What was that first meeting like?

Each side was sizing up the other one. It was rather meaningless conversation, about my hobbies, interests, clothing, general World War II run-of-the-mill something-or-other, and he said when he was taken prisoner at Salzburg at the end of the war, the American GIs took all his medals off him; he had the Knight’s Cross, that was taken from him. He was very upset about that and said, “What I did was…” and he said he put the word out to people — who, I don’t know —but he eventually got all his medals back, and this was years later, this was maybe 8 years or so after he got to Spain.

He said, “I didn’t want a Knight’s Cross or a German Cross or any of the awards, I wanted mine. I knew they were mine because there was a mark on them that my aide Radl had placed on them. I would know if someone was trying to give me a phony or a genuine that wasn’t mine. Wait a second. I’ll go get them.” He went into another part of the house and he came back with a black velvet case with all of his medals on it. There was the Knight’s Cross, the German Cross, the Iron Cross, there were his awards for service on the Russian front and the Western front. He had an SS service medal; he had, it was like a badge — he was very, very proud of that — it was a Nazi pin, not military but like a college association, a youth association member of such-and-such youth — but not Hitler Youth, this was at college level. He also had one cuff band or cuff title, all the SS had cuff titles; they wore them on the left cuff. Regular army units that had cuff titles wore them on the right. This cuff title was black, had the silver line on each side, and the name of the unit, [and] “OTTO SKORZENY.” He laughed and said, “There is no such thing. There never was. Some American sent it to me, and I got a big kick out of it, so I keep it in the collection.”